Annual Brexit Petition
“…demonstrable gibbering nonsense by circus clowns on stilts.”
Not my content, but I HAD to share. In response to the question “Why is there so much dishonesty in the gun debate?” The question linked to this piece about the comparative levels of violence between the US and UK and how the UK’s gun control laws made the UK “safer.” Ah, no. Quoran Alfred Montestruc left this devastating reply echoing Chief Inspector Colin Greenwood.
Your link seems a prime example of extreme dishonesty.
The issue is NOT whether the UK has more violent crime than the USA – which is all the link harps about.
This is not a tennis match, or any sort of national contest.
The issue is whether gun control has any utility whatever in practical control of violent crime.
The author of your link assumes — and never checks his assumption— that gun control laws as applied in the UK reduced violent crime in the UK.
That is demonstrable gibbering nonsense by circus clowns on stilts.
Prior to 1920 in the UK gun laws were more lax in the UK than in the USA if gun control was of any utility one might expect that prior to 1920, violent crime rates in the UK were staggeringly higher than after gun laws were enacted.
The actual case is rather the reverse.
Murder rates per the British office of National Statistics data. No consistent downward trend after gun laws.
VAP is a British Police term that means literal physical violence till they changed the definition in 1998, which is when I stopped tracking. Not going down is it?
The latter graph on rape & indecent assault is included as I was accused by an individual of confusing the two. The latter graph shows the dramatic upward trend continuing into the 21st century. Rape and indecent assault rates show no benefit (reduction) due to gun control laws.
The late 20th century robbery spike is so huge it drowned out important nuances of what happened to robbery rates early in the 20th century.
By the numbers.
Sixteen thousand seven-hundred eighty-three percent rise in robbery rate 1901 to 1998!!
If I took it from the 1915 minimum to the 1995 peak, it was over 50,000% rise !!
So you seem to be claiming that gun control is somehow useful in control of violent crime?
I see you have the nerve, the unmitigated GALL, to talk about “dishonesty”, — just — WOW!
Unbelievable!!
I wish I’d written this. “Gibbering nonsense by circus clowns on stilts” is something I’m going to have to remember.
Health Update: IT’S ALIVE!!!
The new kidney is functional. I was told today “no more dialysis”!! The first night of getting up every 90 minutes to two hours to urinate was oddly satisfying. The second night, not so much. Apparently my bladder has shrunk to the size of an extra-large chicken egg.
I’m back to another six months or so of taking handfulls of pills morning and night, but I tolerate them well. I have to stay up here at Mayo (on campus, but not in the hospital proper) for another four weeks, going in every other day for tests and consults, but things are going swimmingly.
Hopefully no other major medical issues in my future (crossing my fingers.)
Health Update
For my non-Facebooking readers, I received a call from Mayo Tuesday morning – they had a kidney. Had the surgery Tuesday evening. They’re kicking me out of the hospital tonight. Have to spend the next 3-4 weeks up here for testing and examinations while they nail down the right cocktail of drugs (again) and make sure everything is working. Kidney will need a week or so to settle in, so I still have dialysis until then, but looking good so far. Amazingly, once again after a major surgery I have little to no pain except when I try to use my abdominal muscles. Another, not quite as long scar.
I love living in the future.
It’s Not Just Europe
Stanisław Aronson, Polish Jew, veteran of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising, wrote something everyone should read: I Survived the Warsaw Ghetto. Here Are the Lessons I’d Like to Pass On.Pullquotes:
(D)o not ever imagine that your world cannot collapse, as ours did. This may seem the most obvious lesson to be passed down, but only because it is the most important.
—
If disaster comes, you will find that all the myths you once cherished are of no use to you. You will see what it is like to live in a society where morality has collapsed, causing all your assumptions and prejudices to crumble before your eyes. And after it’s all over, you will watch as, slowly but surely, these harshest of lessons are forgotten as the witnesses pass on and new myths take their place.
Enforcement of the Brady Act?
This is Why “Gun Control” Will Never Work, Part Deux
An Investigation by NBC Bay Area in partnership with NBC San Diego, NBC Los Angeles, and the non-profit journalists at The Trace found that law enforcement agencies across California are recovering record numbers of ghost guns. According to several ATF sources, 30 percent of all guns now recovered by agents in communities throughout California are homemade, un-serialized firearms, known on the street as “ghost guns.”
I find that percentage suspiciously high, but the fact remains that Fr. Guido Sarducci in his “Five Minute University” bit got the part about Economics right: “Supply and Demand. That’s it.”
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO8x8eoU3L4]
Of course, the reaction to this is, inevitably, “SOMETHING MUST BE DONE!”
As Tam says, 80% Sten Gun lowers are available at every hardware store, but if you’re really cheap, just build yourself a pipe shotgun. You can use that to upgrade your collection should SHTF.
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AYTIm0zUvI]
Deregulation
I’ve always liked Stossel:
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uc5c_ooIPxE]
This is Why “Gun Control” Will Never Work
If Afghan tribesmen can manufacture AK-47’s in caves with hand tools, imagine what you can do with just a small shop at home. Or even less:
Quora – a Target-Rich Environment
Here’s a short, pithy exchange from Quora. The original answer is mine.
Original question: “How many ‘good guys with guns’ have saved the day against criminals in the US?”
The lowest estimate for defensive gun usage in the U.S. is approximately 108,000 per year – that’s (carry the one…) 295 times a day. The vast majority of these defensive gun uses involve no shots fired. As a result, no mention in the news. A few do make it, like these:
Man holds suspected burglar at gunpoint in east Tulsa
Citizen holds assault suspect at gunpoint at Wenatchee gas station
Deputies: Homeowner pulls gun on intruder with face he won’t forget
Couple holds home invasion suspect at gunpoint
NH Dad Pulls Gun on Intruder Until Police Arrive
Michael Hill
4h agoYou claim 295 times a day then as evidence for decades all over America give just FIVE cases.
How damned stupid do you think we are?
Kevin Baker
Original Author · 3h ago“How damned stupid do think we are?”
I gave five specific instanced in the past few weeks where NO SHOTS WERE FIRED, and the story still made the (local) news.
How stupid do you have to be to misrepresent that?
EDITED TO ADD: A Violence Policy Center paper? Really? An organization dedicated to the banning of all handguns is supposed to be nonpartisan? Pull my other leg.
Michael Hill
2h agoBoring NRA propaganda.
Don’t cry. We won’t take your guns away.
Kevin Baker
Original Author · 1h agoOK, I’ll see your 2015 VPC paper and raise you a 2013 Centers for Disease Control report. They’re a shill for the NRA, right? Who was President in 2013?
From Page 15 of Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence:
“Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed (Cook and Ludwig, 1996; Kleck, 2001a). Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million (Kleck, 2001a), in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008 (BJS, 2010). On the other hand, some scholars point to a radically lower estimate of only 108,000 annual defensive uses based on the National Crime Victimization Survey (Cook et al., 1997). The variation in these numbers remains a controversy in the field. The estimate of 3 million defensive uses per year is based on an extrapolation from a small number of responses taken from more than 19 national surveys. The former estimate of 108,000 is difficult to interpret because respondents were not asked specifically about defensive gun use.”
108,000/365 = 295.89 defensive gun uses PER DAY. Absolute minimum.CDC propaganda? National Crime Victimization Survey propaganda? Or fact?
And you’re right, you won’t.
I’m curious as to whether or not he’ll respond.
UPDATE: He did!
Michael Hill
4m agoLies, lies lies in your article:
“According to the Congressional Research Service, public mass shootings “have claimed 547 lives and led to an additional 476 injured victims” since 1983 (Bjelopera et al., 2013, pp. 7-8). “
Real world with actual data for this year alone:
List of mass shootings in the United States in 2019 – Wikipedia
More lies in your article:
“with ESTIMATES of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million (Kleck, 2001a), in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008 (BJS, 2010). On the other hand, some scholars point to a radically lower ESTIMATE of only 108,000 annual defensive uses based on the National Crime Victimization Survey (Cook et al., 1997). The variation in these numbers remains a controversy in the field. The estimate of 3 million defensive uses per year is based on an extrapolation from a small number of responses taken from more than 19 national surveys.
So it is anything from 108,000 to 500,000 to 3,000,000. What kind of crazy figures are those? They are EXTRAPOLATIONS from a small number of responses.
The great stsistics LIE:
Fascinating new book that shows how easily we’re misled by statistics
Kevin Baker
Original Author · Just nowSo the CDC – and by extension the National Crime Victimization survey are lying. But the Violence Policy Center isn’t. And Wikipedia is never wrong. Because you say so. Check.
(Wikipedia? Seriously? Well, you believe the VPC, so…)
UPDATE II: He came back for more.
Michael Hill
6h agoA Government body lying? Who’d have believed it?
As to wikipedia your arm waving is a decade out of date as they have long ago proved what they say by giving references, etc.
So another failure.
Kevin Baker
Original Author · 3h agoSo the references Wikipedia uses are dependable, but the CDC and Justice Department aren’t because they’re government entities.
What happens when Wikipedia cites government entities?
But hey, let’s use the all-knowing oracle that is Wikipedia – Defensive gun use – Wikipedia
Excerpt – “Estimates over the number of defensive gun uses vary wildly, depending on the study’s definition of a defensive gun use, survey design, country, population, criteria, time-period studied, and other factors. Low-end estimates are in the range of 55,000 to 80,000 incidents per year, while high end estimates reach 4.7 million per year. ”
So let’s take that absolute lowest estimate, 55,000 defensive gun uses per year as our basis. That’s 150 per day. Are you going to tell me that’s false too?